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Author Topic: Pleo starts and stop moving continually  (Read 466 times)

darthsith81

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Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« on: April 08, 2021, 04:01:44 AM »

Hello all
I'm new. I bought 2 used pleos, both of them doesn't work. So I try to fix them.
One pleo doesn't start. No sign of life.
The other instead boot up, make a roar and move. It has broken neck that I have yet fixed.
The problem is that after some seconds after it moves, it shut down suddenly.
I try to touch it for wake up, and sometimes it works, but after some seconds it shut down again.
I have tried to startup with sd card for bypass battery temp check, and it's a bit better, but it's not the solution.

After reading some posts, I noticed that it's common problem, but don't see a solution.
Anyone can help me?

thx
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2021, 02:43:36 AM »

More info: with pop os seems work fine. Very very strange...
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
  • es Male
  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2021, 09:54:04 AM »

Hi Darksith81,


Lord Vader give you the day off?  ;D


Anyway, if the pop os works, why not install 1.1 and see what happens?


Cheers!


Peter
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2021, 03:13:26 AM »

I don't know the exactly reason, but now it works.
I install popos then lifeos 2.0.1, but nothing.
Meanwhile I have modified the battery pack.
Reinstall popos and the lifeos and now seems work.
So I don't know if I have fixed with the battery restoration or with the several tries with updating system.

Now I have to come back to life the other pleo, that seems never used, but doesn't give life sign.
I'll try to see the fuse as the first try.

thx
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
  • es Male
  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2021, 03:30:02 AM »

Hi DarkS,


The fuse is a good place to start if there is no sign of life at all!


Cheers!


Peter
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2021, 06:21:33 AM »

Ok I have more info.
First of all I connected pleo to pc, and see if the pc see it (on macos this is the command system_profiler SPUSBDataType).
With original battery (that works on the other pleo) no result.
With my modified battery (that also works on the other pleo) I see it!
This is the output:
Pleo:

          Product ID: 0x0100
          Vendor ID: 0x6962
          Version: 1.00
          Serial Number: 110401014598
          Speed: Up to 12 Mb/s
          Manufacturer: Ugobe Inc.
          Location ID: 0x14100000 / 12
          Current Available (mA): 500
          Current Required (mA): 100
          Extra Operating Current (mA): 0

So it's very strange.
However it doesn't start, but I exclude the fuse.
So I put the sd card with firmware, and with power switch on or off (it's the same) I can hear three beeps.
What this means?

Thanks
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
  • es Male
  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2021, 08:16:26 AM »

Hi Darth,


3 beeps means the battery is low on charge and Pleo has saved his (or her) current state before shutting down, and it is safe to remove the battery. When the battery is low, Pleo will assume the standard box posture EXCEPT that his head and tail will be down and not straight.


Am I correct that you own a RB version of Pleo?


Cheers!


Peter


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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2021, 08:30:08 AM »

thx for reply.
no, both the pleo are ugobe.
the strange thing is that the original battery (that works on other pleo) don't work on this (both ugobe).
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2021, 10:23:35 AM »

another tip:
pleo that works with original battery with switch on -> see over usb, with switch off -> no usb (like as expected)
pleo that works with custom battery [with 10kohm resistance, or without is the same] with switch on -> see over usb, with switch off -> see over usb (!!!)

pleo that don't work with original battery with switch on -> no usb, with switch off -> no usb
pleo that don't work with custom battery [with 10kohm resistance, or without is the same] with switch on -> see over usb, with switch off -> see over usb (!!!)

I think there is a circuit inside the pleo between the 2 negative poles that check something. And there is something broken in my broken pleo.
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
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  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2021, 12:21:48 PM »

Hey Darth,


There is something between NTC and Ground! It is the temp sensing circuit!  Try an SD card with the skit "Startup script to disable battery temp sensor"  and see if it starts!


Cheers!


Peter
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #10 on: April 13, 2021, 02:03:20 AM »

Hey Darth,


There is something between NTC and Ground! It is the temp sensing circuit!  Try an SD card with the skit "Startup script to disable battery temp sensor"  and see if it starts!


Cheers!


Peter

thx, but unfortunately nothing happens...
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AdamE

  • Sugar cane harvester
  • *** Posts: 39
  • gb
  • Pleo(s): Ogie
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #11 on: April 14, 2021, 01:41:25 AM »

The thermistor in the battery should always be 15kOhms NTC.  Otherwise if lower Pleo will think the battery is warmer than it really is.

If there is some movement, it beeps, or anything then it's not the fuse.  If nothing at all I would suspect the fuse.  However as I found out a few months back there are TWO places the fuse can be!  One is directly in the middle of the fuse board with easy access after a small cut in the plastic.  The other is offset from that and more difficult to get to.... Very annoying.

Never run a Pleo without the thermistor in place, as it simply won't work. Plus never with direct wire link instead of the thermistor to test, this WILL kill your Pleo!

Pleo batteries are interchangeable between models (a Ugobe battery will work in an RB just fine, and the RB battery will work in a Ugobe (with slight modification). So if it works in one functioning Pleo it should work in the other. Which makes me lean towards fuse if it is completely dead.

Any sign of life, or the 'growl then jerk, then repeat 10 seconds later continuously' then I would suspect the thermistor circuit, and the code suggested above should work. 

If not then I am a bit at a loss. Never seen a dead motherboard, but it's possible I guess?
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #12 on: April 14, 2021, 02:24:26 AM »

thanks adamE.
It's very strange. I think that something hardware or software is broken in the pleo, becouse with original battery (that works in the other) it can't be recognized by usb.
I try to start dinomite, official pleo usb updater, but nothing, I have a mac or linux and these software are too old...
I don't know how go ahead...
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AdamE

  • Sugar cane harvester
  • *** Posts: 39
  • gb
  • Pleo(s): Ogie
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #13 on: April 14, 2021, 05:28:19 AM »

Sounds like my Ogie was when I got him - was the main fuse blown. 

I did not try to replace it with a new surface mount fuse as too fiddly - so I bridged the fuse with 3A fuse wire - and it has been fine ever since!
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #14 on: April 14, 2021, 06:43:01 AM »

I don't know. But if the reason was the fuse, I think nothing happens, instead the pc recognize the pleo.
However I can't run dinomite. I install virtualbox with winxp, dinomite with the fix, and I don't know how connect it.
Winxp ask me for driver (that I don't have) and dinomite ask me for comm port (that I don't know).
Any suggestions?
thx
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #15 on: April 14, 2021, 08:44:46 AM »

finally I have connected pleo on pc.
Usb updater can-t find it, but dinomite yes.
This is the output

CPU usage in milliseconds:
  Description           Count       Time    Percent
  -------------------------------------------------
  Initialization            1        853    0.4751%
  Monitor              456597       4373    2.4358%
  Low Level            456597     157055   87.4812%
  High Level           913193       4895    2.7265%
    Script                  0          0    0.0000%
    Motion                  0          0    0.0000%
    Drive                   0          0    0.0000%
    Sensor                  0          0    0.0000%
    Property                0          0    0.0000%
    Animation               0          0    0.0000%
    Behavior                0          0    0.0000%
    Sound                   0          0    0.0000%
    Camera                  0          0    0.0000%
    Resource                0          0    0.0000%
    Application             0          0    0.0000%
  Virtual Machine           0          0    0.0000%
    Initialization          0          0    0.0000%
    Execution               0          0    0.0000%
    Native Calls            0          0    0.0000%
    IO                      0          0    0.0000%
  Filesystem                3          4    0.0022%
  SPI Waiting               0          0    0.0000%
  -------------------------------------------------
  Total                           179530       100%
Number of open files = 0
Files opened = 1
Files closed = 1
Files failed = 0
DF space: total:511104, free:498432
DF FS: Sectors:64 Pages/Sector:128 PageSize:528
Main loop execution time histogram:
Bin    Time Range (ms)    Count  Percent
 0.    1000... 5000        0     0%
 1.     750...  999        0     0%
 2.     500...  749        0     0%
 3.     250...  499        0     0%
 4.     100...  249        0     0%
 5.      75...   99        1     0%
 6.      50...   74        1     0%
 7.      25...   49        0     0%
 8.      10...   24        1     0%
 9.       5...    9        1     0%
10.       0...    4   178505    39%
Stack and heap separation = 2888 bytes; min so far 2888 bytes
Heap address 0x0020EFD0 stack address 0x0020FB18!
                  Battery Voltage = 23, Min 23, Max 23 (tenths of a volt)
              Battery Temperature = 0, Min 100, Max 0 (degrees C)
                  Battery Current = 335, Min 314, Max 335 (milliamperes)
             Battery sensor value = 0 (% capacity remaining)
      Battery sensor direct value = 0, Min 0, Max 0
              Battery Voltage A/D = 208, Min 204, Max 211
          Battery Temperature A/D = 924, Min 915, Max 925
              Battery Current A/D = 47, Min 44, Max 47
            Thermistor Resistance = 204278, Min 185705, Max 205631 (ohms)
      Battery Internal Resistance = 0, Min 100000, Max 0 (milliohms)
        Battery Capacity Consumed = 16 (mAh)
                       Powered up = true
                  RTK Adjustments = 0
                           RTK IK = 0
                           RTK VB = 0
Power monitor reset early warning = 0 (/LLO)
No SD card present
System Statistics:
Sensor Triggers Disabled/Reset Name
     0        0          0 SENSOR_RESERVED
     1        0          0 SENSOR_RESERVED
     2        0          0 SENSOR_BATTERY
     3        0          0 SENSOR_IR
     4        0          0 SENSOR_IR_ACTIVITY
     5        0          0 SENSOR_RESERVED
     6        4          0 SENSOR_HEAD
     7        0          0 SENSOR_CHIN
     8        0          0 SENSOR_BACK
     9        0          0 SENSOR_LEFT_LEG
    10        0          0 SENSOR_RIGHT_LEG
    11        0          0 SENSOR_LEFT_ARM
    12        0          0 SENSOR_RIGHT_ARM
    13        0          0 SENSOR_ARSE
    14        0          0 SENSOR_FRONT_LEFT
    15        0          0 SENSOR_FRONT_RIGHT
    16        1          0 SENSOR_BACK_LEFT
    17        1          0 SENSOR_BACK_RIGHT
    18        0          0 SENSOR_CARD_DETECT
    19        0          0 SENSOR_WRITE_PROTECT
    20       83          0 SENSOR_LEFT_LOUD
    21        0          0 SENSOR_LIGHT
    22       95          0 SENSOR_RIGHT_LOUD
    23       64          0 SENSOR_OBJECT
    24        0          0 SENSOR_MOUTH
    25        0          0 SENSOR_RESERVED
    26      185          0 SENSOR_SOUND_DIR
    27        0          0 SENSOR_LIGHT_CHANGE
    28       87          0 SENSOR_SOUND_LOUD
    29       15          0 SENSOR_TILT
    30       16          0 SENSOR_TERMINAL
    31        0          0 SENSOR_POWER_DETECT
    32        5          0 SENSOR_USB_DETECT
    33        0          0 SENSOR_WAKEUP
    34        0          0 SENSOR_BATTERY_TEMP
    35        0          0 SENSOR_CHARGER_STATE
    36        2          0 SENSOR_SHAKE
    37       80          0 SENSOR_SOUND_LOUD_CHANGE
    38        0          0 SENSOR_BEACON
    39        0          0 SENSOR_BATTERY_CURRENT
    40        0          0 SENSOR_PACKET
Joint Movements DistanceMoved Stalls Displacements Name
    0         0             0      0        0 J_RIGHT_SHOULDER
    1         0             0      0        0 J_RIGHT_ELBOW
    2         0             0      0        0 J_LEFT_SHOULDER
    3         0             0      0        0 J_LEFT_ELBOW
    4         0             0      0        0 J_LEFT_HIP
    5         0             0      0        0 J_LEFT_KNEE
    6         0             0      0        0 J_RIGHT_HIP
    7         0             0      0        0 J_RIGHT_KNEE
    8         0             0      0        0 J_TORSO
    9         0             0      0        0 J_TAIL_HORIZONTAL
   10         0             0      0        0 J_TAIL_VERTICAL
   11         0             0      0        0 J_NECK_HORIZONTAL
   12         0             0      0        0 J_NECK_VERTICAL
ID: USSF Revision: 4
Pleo S/N: 110401014598; Dataflash Security ID: 15183603
Total run time (seconds): 3190
Stats write count: 10, last written: 3010
Atmel: resets:6, upgrade count: 0
NXP:   resets:6, upgrade count: 0, upgrade failures: 0, crashes: 0
MotorController resets: 0; Comm Errors: TSB0=303813 TSB1=3 TSB2=0 TSB3=1
SD card insertions: 0, removals: 0
HL loads: 0, unloads: 0
Motion files played: 0
Amp enabled count: 0
Sound files played: 0
Sound output seconds: 0
Times powered down: 0, powered up: 0
Sleep count: controlled: 0, forced: 0
Charge cycle count: 0, aborted charges: 0, overtemp charges: 0
Cycle OTemp UpRun DnRun StVolt EndVolt StChg EndChg StIntRes EndIntRes
   -4     0   297     0     23      23  2200   2172        0         0
   -3     0  1198     0     23      23  2172   2066        0         0
   -2     0   299     0     23      22  2066   2037        0         0
   -1     0   600     0     22      23  2037   1982        0         0
    0     0   597     0     23      23  1982   1927        0         0
    1     0   179     0     23      23  1927   1911        0         0
Overall Average Charge Statistics:
    0     0  3170     0      0       0     0      0        0         0

MotorController Stats
Enable = 1, Timer Enable 1, Stall Detect Enable 1
*** MotorController0: Good 1, Configured 1, Comm Failure 1, Output Bits 01
Xfers: good 309, bad 21091, faults 1
  CH  Vectors RegPolls LatePolls LateDuration Moving Enabled DirectPWM Joint Name
   0       0       10         0            0      0       0         0     1 J_RIGHT_ELBOW
   1       0       11         0            0      0       0         0     0 J_RIGHT_SHOULDER
   2       0       11         0            0      0       0         0    12 J_NECK_VERTICAL
   3       0       10         0            0      0       0         0    11 J_NECK_HORIZONTAL
*** MotorController1: Good 1, Configured 1, Comm Failure 1, Output Bits 01
Xfers: good 308, bad 3, faults 0
  CH  Vectors RegPolls LatePolls LateDuration Moving Enabled DirectPWM Joint Name
   0       0       10         0            0      0       0         0     3 J_LEFT_ELBOW
   1       0       11         0            0      0       0         0     2 J_LEFT_SHOULDER
   2       0       10         0            0      0       0         0    13 J_HEAD
   3       0       10         0            0      0       0         0     8 J_TORSO
*** MotorController2: Good 1, Configured 1, Comm Failure 1, Output Bits 01
Xfers: good 308, bad 2, faults 0
  CH  Vectors RegPolls LatePolls LateDuration Moving Enabled DirectPWM Joint Name
   0       0       10         0            0      0       0         0     5 J_LEFT_KNEE
   1       0       11         0            0      0       0         0     4 J_LEFT_HIP
   2       0       10         0            0      0       0         0     7 J_RIGHT_KNEE
   3       0       10         0            0      0       0         0     6 J_RIGHT_HIP
*** MotorController3: Good 0, Configured 0, Comm Failure 1, Output Bits 00
Xfers: good 0, bad 1, faults 0
  CH  Vectors RegPolls LatePolls LateDuration Moving Enabled DirectPWM Joint Name
   0       0        0         0            0      0       1         0    10 J_TAIL_VERTICAL
   1       0        0         0            0      0       1         0     9 J_TAIL_HORIZONTAL
   2       0        0         0            0      0       0         0    -1 J_NONE
   3       0        0         0            0      0       0         0    -1 J_NONE
VM statistics not enabled
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #16 on: April 14, 2021, 09:13:36 AM »

I think it's a power problem:              Battery sensor value = 0 (% capacity remaining)

However the battery is good, and works on the other pleo...
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
  • es Male
  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #17 on: April 15, 2021, 02:17:43 AM »

Hi Darth,


Did you notice battery voltage?   Battery Voltage = 23, Min 23, Max 23 (tenths of a volt)
That is 2.3 volts (not going to run a pleo on 2.3 volts)


Just saying, should be 8.4 volts on a fully charged battery.
More common than "dead" motherboards are bent or broken, or partially mated pins between the motherboard and the "daughtercards" that carry voltages, ground, and signals from the power input card and the servo drivers.

power stats from working pleo:



<=== SENDING COMMAND ===>
stats power
                  Battery Voltage = 83, Min 83, Max 84 (tenths of a volt)
              Battery Temperature = 23, Min 23, Max 23 (degrees C)
                  Battery Current = 278, Min 278, Max 2659 (milliamperes)
             Battery sensor value = 100 (% capacity remaining)
      Battery sensor direct value = 100, Min 0, Max 100
              Battery Voltage A/D = 743, Min 643, Max 745
          Battery Temperature A/D = 345, Min 232, Max 346
              Battery Current A/D = 39, Min 39, Max 372
            Thermistor Resistance = 11390, Min 9713, Max 11448 (ohms)
      Battery Internal Resistance = 0, Min 100000, Max 0 (milliohms)
        Battery Capacity Consumed = 10 (mAh)
                       Powered up = true
                  RTK Adjustments = 0
                           RTK IK = 0
                           RTK VB = 0
Power monitor reset early warning = 0 (/LLO)
Cheers!


Peter
« Last Edit: April 15, 2021, 02:25:07 AM by pnhicks »
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #18 on: April 15, 2021, 02:24:54 AM »

You are right, but the battery is fully charged, and runs on the other pleo (that connect to dinomite give right value).
So I don't know if the contact inside the broken pleo are ruined, or something worst is on the power circuit inside the pleo.
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
  • es Male
  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #19 on: April 15, 2021, 09:34:13 AM »

Hi Darth,


We are currently working on a very similar problem on another pleo, see xu peng's post "my pleo cannot detect the battery".

His blew a fuse after reverse battery installation as well!

Cheers!

Peter
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #20 on: April 15, 2021, 09:56:00 AM »

Yes I read it, but it's not clear to me (I'm not electronic expert).
However what I can say is that the battery has 1+ and 2- connected by thermistore (or resistore).
And what I can see is that I have 8.2v between + and -, and 8.1 on the other -, the pleo doesn't work (like instead it will).
Instead if I have 8.2 and 2.5v in the other -, the pleo doesn't work, but it will recognized by usb, with switch on or off is the same.
So it's very strange, but is something inside the pleo that does't work. Maybe some fuse, but I think not the main fuse. I don't know.
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
  • es Male
  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #21 on: April 15, 2021, 11:08:09 AM »

Hi Darth,


Well as AdamE pointed out, there is another fuse (not located on the power board, purple board), but on the motherboard (the one under the "back" of pleo, You have to remove the waist/mid-body joint servo to gain access.)


More frequently, I have seen bent or miss aligned pins connecting to the motherboard as power problems.


Good Luck!


Peter
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darthsith81

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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #22 on: April 16, 2021, 12:59:56 AM »

thx for help.
anyone have some photos so I can understand better what I have to do?
thx
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pnhicks

  • Pleozoologist
  • * Posts: 233
  • es Male
  • Pleo(s): None of mine stay in one piece long enough! :((
  • You can't break what's already broken!
Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #23 on: April 16, 2021, 03:50:46 AM »

Hi Darth,


here is a tear down video:


https://youtu.be/sk8H3lz_jfc


The first board being mounted in the plastic frame is the "motherboard."  Clearly visible is the 3A fuse exactly like the one on the purple (lower) power input board (the one with on/off switch).


Photo of Pleo hardware:





https://1drv.ms/u/s!As6F3Yo9RNKWwQ4jbGKYANGaGV7Y?e=Zdbiim


Close up of contacts:
https://1drv.ms/u/s!As6F3Yo9RNKWwRDH7Lma507zDqX1?e=yJwjbx


That will have to do for now!


Cheers!


Peter

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darthsith81

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  • ** Posts: 17
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Re: Pleo starts and stop moving continually
« Reply #24 on: April 17, 2021, 01:23:30 AM »

I have disassembled, but is hard to find the problem now...
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